Curse

FeroxC · Apr 29, 2007, 11:30 PM // 23:30

I love the Paragon class, I had been playing a warrior for the majority of 2 years but i like the flexible & more relaxing play style of the Paragon.
So far ive completed nightfall and vanquished 6 areas in prophecies(mostly kryta) with a Paragon.

Why paragons are unpopular

Paragons dont have a defined role like the other classes especially in prophecies they are an 'extra' option when you want to pad your team out.
The Paragon start is slow, if youve just bought Nightfall and create both a Paragon and Dervish at the same time. The Dervish is alot more fun at that level as the Paragon needs a large skill pool to be used properly.
Theres a unconstructive "Paragons are useless stereotype" meaning you wont be invited into groups.
Thanks to abuse in PVP alot of Paragon skills which were only overpowed when massed have been nerfed which has made them underpowered in PVE e.g. check out the duration and cost of the elite skill "incoming" unfortunatly the over-reaction has destroyed the Paragon reputation.

Why Paragons are good

Paragon can be flexible either as a:

Damage dealer with spears, and easy to maintain IAS skills such as "aggressive refrain" the Paragon has a very high DPS.
Support class unlike a monk theres no cookie cutter builds the skills available are very specialist so you need to have a large skill pool, and consider the builds of your teammates as well as skills of the local wildlife .

In conclusion Paragons are a good class, just misunderstood.

Tenebros · May 01, 2007, 02:11 PM // 14:11

I'm amazed at how rabid some anti-paragons are out there. Seriously, I've been playing with my latest creation and I like what she does. I kill things pretty well, allow others to kill them better and prevent damage to my peeps all at the same time. I never die, unless I've done something stupid, nor have any situations been out of my powers to solve. Even in PUGs I have been the last character standing with a handy Res. (No, they didn't die sacrificing themselves for me) I do struggle with Conditions sometimes, but a simple adjustment to mine or my Hero's skill bar and everything's just swell. I've tried everything else out there, other than a Rt, and I like the Paragon for the combos (attack, conditions, heal, shield squishies) and find them pretty elegant overall. I still like my elementalist the best, then maybe my axe warrior, but my paragon really isn't that far behind them (though it's early). I'm certain that someone wil call me an idiot or something, but as far as the reasons why I play GW, I dig my paragon.

Zephere901 · May 01, 2007, 03:49 PM // 15:49

Olias & Master of Whispers MM + General Morgahn + You = I win button

nough said

Tenebros · May 02, 2007, 04:46 PM // 16:46

So Zephere, would you set the necro pair up with different skills sets (say curse and mm) to augment a para's strategies or run them both as mm's? Also, can you elaborate on the synergy between two para's working together? I have some ideas, but have yet to put them into practice. If anyone else has ideas, I'd certainly love to hear them!

clawofcrimson · May 02, 2007, 09:20 PM // 21:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenebros

So Zephere, would you set the necro pair up with different skills sets (say curse and mm) to augment a para's strategies or run them both as mm's? Also, can you elaborate on the synergy between two para's working together? I have some ideas, but have yet to put them into practice. If anyone else has ideas, I'd certainly love to hear them!

You can visit the paragon forums. There are some pretty decent ideas there. as well as a twin para build i posted.

In fact, for anyone who still 'misunderstands' the paragon, I have recently completed a guid on it. which can be found here.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10151254

art of war · May 03, 2007, 12:02 AM // 00:02

I think paragons are excellent class if play well and the player knows what hes going with them. Also, in gvg my guild usually has me play anthem of guidence or crippling anguish. But the reason I like the paragon class the most is focus anger and its gives x% adrenaline and its not a stance warriors have nothan on that.

My favourite motivation skill its "just a flesh wound" and mixing it with finale of restoration casue u can spam it. Only problem i see with paragons is lack of pve builds but its fun making ur own instead of borrowing someone elses.

Also, people need to relize that paragons are mixture of damage and support maybe not as good a monk but paragons can lift some of the stress off monks if played properly.

Kumlekar · May 03, 2007, 03:06 AM // 03:06

Iv personally like having a paragon or two on my team (especially if one has anthom of burning) but I could do with out, They could use some minor buffs, but the class tries to do too much at once and is weakened by it. I'm not saying they can't be extremely effective though. a couple months ago I saw a team win HOH with 4 paragons and 4 warriors. I'm going to try one out after I get another character slot.

Mekkakat · May 08, 2007, 01:25 PM // 13:25

i came to this thread from the campfire version of it, and im almost terrified to read all of the post so far..

my 3 fav classes, warrior, ranger, paragon, with paragon coming very close to my top pick. heres why..

there is such arrogance, mixed with ignorance dealing with spears.. they do a sensational amount of damage, and the skills that they use are nothing more than ranged warrior skills. at 16 spear mastery, most of their attacks hit harder than some of the BEST axe/sword moves. rangers are the kings of conditions/interrupts.. but its ranged bother lays it on the line and puts out dps like no other class. with super fast paced, target switching, smooth deep wounds, nothing can compare to that, and the ability to be so versatile. people are just angry because they dont understand, and by not understanding, they judge.. also.. it seems as though we have a few with their fingers in their ears going la la la. true, some of their moves got nerfed, big whoop, they were, and still are SUPER powered. command is a beast in almost any situation, even with only one para, also, motivation is still 100% viable and used ALL the time by people that know what they're doing.

i went through NF second with my paragon, and LOVED the ENTIRE pve game with him. i could go spear.. motivation.. command.. anything, and i never had a problem with damage/healing/ect. Shouts are practically unstoppable (minus a few nec moves.. but who cares lol), and better than that, echoes last indefinitely. (basically). i liked paragons so much, they became my second character next to warrior, and i play them just as much, with ZERO problems getting into pve groups, especially in HM. i've never been asked "hey para, whats your skills", because it seems like most have gotten over the nooby attitude of "paras suck", and faced facts to realize how wrong they were. Paras are also undisputed kings in PvE/PvP when in packs, and even with only one, the damage OR support (you get to PICK surprise surprise), will be second to none with their sweet range, and even better skills. do you like melee? do you like being far enough to not get hit, still be able to kite, basically always out survive everything, and still support your team while killing the crap out of the other? well if you dont, you must hate life, because you're really missing out on literally one of (imo) the best classes in the game.

Mekkakat · May 08, 2007, 01:38 PM // 13:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spura

If using short bow and Kindle Arrows, the Ranger's damage is higher than Paragon's.

Rangers have a lot of bow attacks to choose from and a lot of preparations.

They can opt for Kindle Arrows in which case they outdamage paragon.
They can opt for Read the Wind in which case they do good damage and their arrows can't be dodged.
They can opt for Choking Gas or any other interrupting preparation.

They can mix and match preparations with attacks where they can choose extra damage, bleed, poison, burn, daze and cripple, double arrows and AoE attack(barrage) and awesome interrupts(not like lame Disrupting Throw).

In addition to that they can also go traps or pet.

They also have game altering spirits.

They are versatile, and have many options. Paragon has like a few good skills that everybody uses and so we have 90% same builds. No options there.

kindle is secondary elemental damage, that still wouldnt put the dps higher than a para.. maybe Glass Arrows.. but i think you need to rework your mechanics...

also, Disrupting Throw is by no means "lame", and for your information, last time i checked, Rangers have been around.. oh i dont know.. since the beginning of GWs. Jesus, you expect them to add a profession with a million moves and on top of that, be a clone of every other class? i guess dervs should have shouts like warriors, and sins should have a version of defensive stance, or else they're obsolete. i hope all of em' drop game altering spirits too. Rangers SPECIALIZE in traps/nature rituals/interrupting, read the manual and you'll see that. dont hate on the para cause you dont understand

IlikeGW · May 08, 2007, 11:16 PM // 23:16

I think they're misunderstood for a reason, their class design pushes them into too many unconventional niches at once. Like the mesmer, people are going to have a hard time saying "and bring a paragon for X" for most things. They might have gotten nerfed for being overpowered in PVP, but as usual PVE players got left to fend for themselves once the class had it's strengths toned out of popularity.

rick1027 · May 09, 2007, 05:17 PM // 17:17

personally i really like the paragon it is one of my favorite classes top play and to have anyone say they didn't need that nerf stick in my opinion you are wrong they were greatly overpowered. there are a few things that i think in my opinion that could be buffed about a paragon but it is a very playable class and has a lot to contribute to a party.

Qpidonas · May 21, 2007, 11:42 AM // 11:42

I was realy happy playing my para, till i faced the problem with party finding for hard areas. For pve I enjoyed ->> fire/GFTE build +2 x Barrage rangers +MM (heroes) + 1 Derv + 1 fire ele +2monks (hench). Now my para works as storage char as after some time i find it borring.

Renegade26 · May 21, 2007, 12:21 PM // 12:21

Tbh I think the spears and skills for spears are pretty overpowered. Agg. Refrain can be kept up easily with just yourself, and even easier with another Paragon doing the same. The attacks can deal 50 damage and around 100 with Spear of Lightning.

Thats just too strong imo for a ranged weapon that can buff itself up with numerous different options.

Stormlord Alex · May 21, 2007, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Most misunderstood.

As a long-time warrior, I adore the paragon's damage dealing capabilities. The numbers show that the actual DPS of a spear chucker is incredible, and the attack buffs they give to the rest of the party are sweet too.
Also, Aggressive Refrain is... insane.

lellyville · May 21, 2007, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus The Avatar

I love the paragon class find them to be very usefull. And don't understand why people dont use them.

maybe because male paragons wear skirts, and female paragon also wears skirts

clawofcrimson · May 21, 2007, 06:48 PM // 18:48

ya... i am hoping for some nice new armour in GWEN.

LouAl · May 22, 2007, 11:09 PM // 23:09

Poorly implemented. Other than that it could be better, but so could all the rest of the professions. The biggest problem that I see is that the paragon is supposed to be the party leader, but having more than one makes it MUCH better. The exact opposite of what happens when you have more than one leader on most real life teams - not that real life comparisons are great in a game that uses magic...But other professions suffer from diminishing returns on the number of that profession in the party (see: monk). It just seems like the skills could have done essentially the same thing, but helped the team more with just one and diminishing with more than one.

Anyway, I like the para and have never had any real issues getting in groups, but I compare it in my mind to back in the day when I'd try to get in groups with my mesmer...this is nothing compared to that.

A couple people have said that the DW ability of the para is superior to other classes, but I am not sure how that is. All of them are conditional whereas other classes have non-conditional DW.

The last thing, and biggest reason why people hate/don't play the Para: the skirt.

Moa Bird Cultist · May 24, 2007, 11:12 AM // 11:12

They were poorly implemented insomuch as they were massively overpowered when they were introduced and required a lot of nerfing to get them in line with other classes, therefore putting a lot of people off. In that respect, they were poorly implemented.

Their actual practical use? Here's a few things from my experience. Cautery Signet has no equal. Martyr is nowhere near as good. Aggressive Refrain... oh yes, not exactly a bad skill there... Go For The Eyes, I consider to be the offensive counterpart to Watch Yourself. And Hexbreaker Aria, I wouldn't go anywhere in endgame nightfall without it. And spear chuckers have godly DPS, everyone knows that.

Threll · May 24, 2007, 06:51 PM // 18:51

If it's seriously just the look of the armor that's bothering you, then delete your Paragon and swear to me you'll never roll another... blasphemers!

They're supposed to be like a mixture of like Greek and Roman style warrior garb. Check this out: historically, GREEK AND ROMAN WARRIORS WORE "SKIRTS." And sandals. And threw spears. Get over your thinly-veiled homophobia and just mix and match your armor set. I've got one that I think looks pretty good, skirt or no skirt.

Also... why list Spear of Lightning as the "hoss" damage dealer? Doesn't Cruel Spear blow it out of the water?

2 cents: I love the Paragon, and I think they are grossly misunderstood. If a party needs damage, a tank, support, or a part-time healer... it's all in the bag.

Mekkakat · May 24, 2007, 08:06 PM // 20:06

three words:

thank
you
threll

i honestly dont get how anyone thinks Cruel Spear isnt the best spear move in the game. crazy damage, super easy conditional deep wound, and a win win with its brother (and my second fav spear move) HARRIERS TOSS.

so pathetic to see so many homophobes whine about the Romanesque theme of such a godly profession.. sigh